2 teens dismembered 'friend,' set him on fire
About a minute of raw video from the Las Vegas Police press conference held Friday afternoon.
In this post, published earlier today, I gave credit to a commenter who uses the nickname "joe." After the Las Vegas Review-Journal published an article this morning connecting Cole Puffinburger's drug-running maternal grandfather to millions of dollars stolen from a drug cartel, it became clear that this particular commenter had inside knowledge. "Joe" had posted about the very same revelations more than 24 hours before they made it into the Las Vegas paper.
Joe has written in again, leaving a comment on that same blog post. In his/her comment, Joe tells us in more detail about what's transpired in the Tinnemeyer/Puffinburger family over the last year or more. Joe's narrative adds to the portion of the news conference captured above.
Joe acknowledged posting information in advance of the mainstream news and wrote that "the reason that I know this is that I am a close personal friend of the family but wish to remain anonymous." Joe continued, "I am only posting in hopes that this may help people know what they are looking for and so people don't assume that the parents were involved and not look for what they should."
Then Joe launched into the meat of the story. "The grandfather who goes by the name Clem (police have just today issued a APB for him for questioning and yes you are right about him and the info you have posted Steve) was a drug runner for the Mexican drug cartels, mafia whatever they are one in the same. He found out where they kept their money hidden and stole millions of dollars as well as millions in drugs from the cartel and disappeared."
So far, it sounds a little like the plot of Cormac McCarthy's No Country For Old Men. But Clemens F. Tinnemeyer Jr. wasn't involved with some fictional latino drug mob (and, it should be said, no Anton Chigurh has appeared on the scene yet either, thank God). More from Joe: "The mother, her boyfriend or father of this boy never had any connection to this illegal activity whatsoever and were unaware of his involvement until a couple of months ago." Here Joe posed a compelling question: "Think about this logically if they had anything to do with this activity or the stolen money and drugs do you think they would have stayed here?"
Then Joe set about clearing up some misinformation -- "Another point I would like to make is that it is being falsely reported out there that the grandfather was the 'owner' of the drug cartel, totally false. Now think about this very clearly people, Do you think the 'owner' of a drug cartel would not have his entire family completely protected 24 hours a day but an army of guards?"
The money men who could afford to "run" an international drug-dealing operation often live in circumstances where they could fight off a small army if needed. This clearly wasn't the case with Cole Puffinburger's family. Clemens Tinnemeyer's name was easily found in property tax records, as was other personal information.
Clemens Tinnemeyer, Joe pointed out, "is only a drug runner who thought he was slick enough to get away from people that no one really get away from."
Joe addressed the issue of ransom. "This is and this isn't a ransom case, yes they want money but not because the grandfather or parents are rich but because the grandfather took that which was not his for the taking. The boyfriend of the boy's mother is not mexican or a drug dealer nor is his father or mother."
Julie Puffinburger had heard from someone connected to Clem Tinnemeyer's deadly pursuers before. Someone had come to the Puffinburger residence "a couple of months back," according to Joe, "and told her about the situation [...] that her father stole from them and they just wanted to locate him and get back what belonged to them." Julie and her boyfriend "were very scared," Joe wrote, "but did agree to help see if she could get a hold of her father since she had no knowledge of this and wanted nothing to do with it." And ironically, Julie didn't "want any harm to come to her or her son." Julie Puffinburger tried to find Clemens Tinnemeyer, but she had no luck. Her father had "dropped off the face of the earth." All anyone knew about Tinnemeyer at that point was that "he was last seen in Tennesee but that was the last lead they had."
Later in his/her long post (seemingly written in haste), Joe wrote this interesting passage, "The police were informed of this situation from the beginning(,) but there was little they could do as they were also looking for the grandfather as well [...] and there was really only an implied threat made(,) and these men did really seem to just want to find her father and not to harm her."
Next, Joe wanted to clarify how the men entered the residence on Wednesday morning. Joe's depiction of Cole's abduction was harrowing: "The mother did not let these men in her house, she was getting ready to take her child to school heard a knock on the door [...] asked who was there [and] when they said police she thought with all that had going on lately that it probably was them there to talk to her about her father, and she mistakenly opened the door. This is when these men forced their way in, searched the house for the money and when they didn't find it ripped the child out of the mother's boyfriend's arms (he was crying and screaming hysterically,poor baby), tied them up and left with the boy."
Joe then defended Cole's mother: "A lot of people are saying the mom keeps changing her story, she does not the media and the cops are the ones either misreporting or reporting bits and pieces at a time I know the police were aware of all of this from minute one but they may have been waiting for confirmation of the facts before releasing them and that is why it seems the story keeps changing. Remember the story is only changing in the media not in reality the mother, father and boyfriend have always given the same story, but the public is only hearing trickles of information until I believe they confirm it. This is a very sad scary and true situation."
Finally, the commenter addressed the doubts first expressed here and elsewhere about the story of Cole's abduction: "I hope I have clarified this situation for all of you and you all understand how important it is to not judge or jump to conclusions. I have to admit in past cases I have jumped to conclusions but now seeing this from a totally different perspective it makes me rethink other cases and wonder if it only seemed the way it did because the media either got it wrong or only reported half truths and bit of information."
Near the end of the commentary, Joe wrote the following. It probably speaks to many who come to this post in an effort to try and find out more about this little boy's inexplicable and terrifying kidnapping: "We all have a child or children in our lives we love that we would be devastated if something like this happened to so please when you look at Cole's sweet face remember that. Remember that he could be your son, daughter, grandson, granddaughter, niece or nephew or just a dear friend's child but just see that child you know and love in his smile and think about what you would do to bring them home and do that, help in anyway you can. Please!!!"







In the 6th paragraph you state that joe "made" perfect sense, not "makes". You are a very concise writer;I question the meaning of your tense. Is there an under tone to this comment? This information feels very "formulated". Who is Joe?
Posted 10/17/2008 at 10:15:57 PMNo, Mayebelle, the error is simply bad editing on my part, and you have jumped to an unfounded conclusion. Nothing more to it than that. I'm not giving out any information about Joe, at Joe's request. All I have are IP addresses and an e-mail address.
Posted 10/17/2008 at 10:23:30 PMThank you Steve
Posted 10/17/2008 at 10:37:51 PMI just wonder why they stayed after the first visit. I am not trying to judge anyone, but Joe himself said the mom was scared when she received that visit. Whether she thought their only intentions were just to find the grandfather or not, she gambled big time and lost. I pray for little Cole.
Posted 10/17/2008 at 10:51:13 PMI have been sending up MANY prayers for this little boy. I have a six year old little blonde haired blue eyed boy, and it just tears me up to read this. I pray for him constantly, and hope others are doing the same. Now, what I wanted to say was immediately send an email to everyone in your address book, you're not being abnoxious with your loooong list, just do it! Put the info, the picture of the boy and his grandfathers picture and info in it and hit send. Don't forget to tell them to send it to everyone they know. I had heard of this case in passing, but not everyone knows when an amber alert goes out. We people of the US need to band together against this, and use our power of 'gab' to flood the cyber space with email all over and posts on every message board about these things so the kids are found before long. So, please don't hesitate do it now!
Posted 10/17/2008 at 11:15:39 PMSince no one knows who this "Joe" is that's posting, we have no way of knowing what he says is fact. I'm not disclaiming his post, only keeping an open mind as to what facts he has given.
I find it unusual that Julie has not come forward to the Media as of yet to plead for her son's return, most mom's do.
Maybe his daughter only recently found out about her dad's dealing, but her mom has had to have known.
Posted 10/17/2008 at 11:17:08 PMInlandEmpire -- I thought I stated clearly in this and an earlier post that news that only made it into the papers this morning was already posted in a comment by "Joe" here a full 24 hours beforehand. So far, Joe is batting a thousand. And as far as the post above is concerned, most of it can be verified by what's been reported elsewhere. I thought Joe's comment was worth another entry because I felt readers should, if nothing else, get a hint of Joe's perspective. I'm just puzzled by your skepticism when Joe was writing things here well in advance of the same information being published in the news and nothing said in this particular post is wildly at odds with what's been reported by Las Vegas and national media. I suspect, based on the comment I'm responding to, that your skepticism may be rooted in Joe's clear association with and defense of Julie Puffinburger. Am I right? Just say so. I may not entirely agree with you, but I understand, if that's the case.
Posted 10/17/2008 at 11:24:04 PMthis kid is the lindbergh baby of mexican cartel kidnapping.
Posted 10/17/2008 at 11:31:37 PMThank you for restating what needed to be told. The TV news will report what it can and the public needs to realize their is always more to the story. In this situation the mother is living in a nightmare and we need to thank a HIGHER BEING we are not in her shoes. The public also needs to help! Don't be afraid to get involved - what if it were a family member. Look out the window or call the police if something is wrong. Living in fear or not helping one another is not a great way of life. Don't be foolish, use good common sense and be safe. Say a prayer once in a while!
Posted 10/18/2008 at 12:41:32 AMThe grandfather has been arrested in California not sure how I feel about this (whether it is good or bad for Cole I mean) but it is news. To answer an earlier question about why the family stayed after the first visit, well the day Cole was kidnapped was the last day the family was actually living in that house they were moving into another house (at a location I will not disclose for obvious reasons).
Posted 10/18/2008 at 04:31:32 AMNot sure whether or not this is what caused the kidnappers to act when they did (meaning they saw that they were moving and thought this was the time to act, or that they thought they were running because they knew the grandfather was) or if it was just coincidence. I did not mention it before for obvious reasons. I also would like people to keep in mind that this family is not wealthy ( not the daughter anyway, the grandfather has millions in stolen drug money) so ask yourself if you would be able to come up with the money to either move tomorrow or flee to somewhere, leaving your job etc., if something like this happened. I think it was a total of about 6-8 weeks since they first were notified of the threat and they were moving the next day. So seems like a reasonable amount of time to me.
The grandfather has been arrested in California not sure how I feel about this (whether it is good or bad for Cole I mean) but it is news. To answer an earlier question about why the family stayed after the first visit, well the day Cole was kidnapped was the last day the family was actually living in that house they were moving into another house (at a location I will not disclose for obvious reasons).
Posted 10/18/2008 at 04:32:27 AMNot sure whether or not this is what caused the kidnappers to act when they did (meaning they saw that they were moving and thought this was the time to act, or that they thought they were running because they knew where the grandfather was) or if it was just coincidence. I did not mention it before for obvious reasons. I also would like people to keep in mind that this family is not wealthy ( not the daughter anyway, the grandfather has millions in stolen drug money) so ask yourself if you would be able to come up with the money to either move tomorrow or flee to somewhere, leaving your job etc., if something like this happened. I think it was a total of about 6-8 weeks since they first were notified of the threat and they were moving the next day. So seems like a reasonable amount of time to me.
Exactly. How easy do you think it is to just pick up and hide? Do you have a new house and job just waiting in case something happens? Maybe it looks easy in the movies but this is real life, you know.
I think a public appeal to a drug cartel would fall on deaf ears. Don't judge her, you aren't in her shoes.
Posted 10/18/2008 at 12:07:22 PMI appreciate the info from Joe and accept it at face value. I am usually a skeptical person but, I believe him. Thx, Joe
Posted 10/18/2008 at 12:35:44 PMI fear for Coles life and well being. Poor little guy.
Why is it that when someone is accused of changing her/his story that person always blame the cops or media for taking it out of context? For example, this Julie Puffinburger, mom of the poor boy kidnapped by drug dealers thanks to the so called "Profession" of her Dad, who is a known drug trader. First off, I would not have a convicted felon and drug trader (her dad) living with my child. I mean, what parent will allow a criminal live with them that is dangerously dealing with drugs, relative or not be damned. Guess it takes all kinds to make the world go around. I have my suspicions on the Mom (the apple doesn't fall far from the tree). Would really like to know how she makes an income. On Nancy Grace last nite, the reporter said the whole family is being investigated to see if they are also involved with drugs, the only one exempt from investigation is Cole's dad. Kinda odd she hasn't been seen in public pleading for the safe return of her son. Sure makes me wonder if she's more involved in this because a cop spokesman said "the only innocent person in this whole thing is Cole." He didn't say anything about the Mom being innocent. Hmmmmm....
Posted 10/18/2008 at 12:56:22 PMShivon:
I said I was not trying to judge the family. After all, I do not have all the facts. Joe stated afterward that they were trying to move, which makes more sense.
But yes, I think it was reasonable to question WHY you would stay in a residence with your child when a Mexican drug cartel has already paid a visit to your family, scared you, and told you that your father owed them millions. I dont think for ME it would have equate to being as far fetched as a movie plot. Common sense would say its time to leave.
Respectfully,
Posted 10/18/2008 at 01:08:31 PMKindraLore
Shivon:
I said I was not trying to judge the family. After all, I do not have all the facts. Joe stated afterward that they were trying to move, which makes more sense.
But yes, I think it was reasonable to question WHY you would stay in a residence with your child when a Mexican drug cartel has already paid a visit to your family, scared you, and told you that your father owed them millions. I dont think for ME it would have equate to being as far fetched as a movie plot. Common sense would say its time to leave.
Respectfully,
Posted 10/18/2008 at 01:10:28 PMKindraLore
Sorry for the double post.
Posted 10/18/2008 at 01:18:36 PMOddly enough someone by the name of InlandEmpire posted here and that is where the grandfather was found.
Posted 10/18/2008 at 01:46:47 PMInlandEmpire - Isn't Riverside in the "Inland Empire"? Do you know the grandfather?
Posted 10/18/2008 at 03:23:22 PMFolks, InlandEmpire has commented on other blogs in the past. You all are reading too much into that. The screen name and the e-mail address attached are very familiar to me. If I were a New York cop, I'd be telling you, "nothing to see here, move along."
Posted 10/18/2008 at 03:29:32 PMThis is so sad. Whatever the case with the family right now the most important thing is that this innocent little boy is found unharmed and brought safely back. Praying for his safe return. Please would joe continue his postings to keep us informed of the situation regarding this little boy. I cannot believe that grown men can do this to a child for any reason. Shame on them.
Posted 10/18/2008 at 03:52:06 PMThis is so sad. Whatever the case with the family right now the most important thing is that this innocent little boy is found unharmed and brought safely back. Praying for his safe return. Please would joe continue his postings to keep us informed of the situation regarding this little boy. I cannot believe that grown men can do this to a child for any reason. Shame on them.
Posted 10/18/2008 at 03:52:50 PMYou can always tell the posters who have had any contact with the "real world" when it comes to true crime, and those who haven't. Picking up and moving at the drop of a hat when you have a family/small children/a job ain't easy, especially when your ne'er do well father hasn't bothered to give you the funds to escape his enemies. And going to the cops to inform on your FATHER, even if he is a royal asswipe, ain't easy either.
Posted 10/18/2008 at 04:36:40 PMLOL, thank you Steve!
I loved your comment "If I were a New York cop, I'd be telling you, "nothing to see here, move along."
Somehow in my gut I felt Clem would come down this way and MAY have been down here for quite a while. I'm looking forward to the Presser coming up in 15 minutes, hopefully it will be good news regarding Cole.
Posted 10/18/2008 at 04:46:33 PMLOL! Sorry about that InlandEmpire. It was just something that I noticed and thought it a strange coincedence. Sorry about that...=)
I hope little Cole is found safe!
Posted 10/18/2008 at 05:23:21 PMNancy:
I have no intentions of getting into a pissing match over my own opinion on this, nor did I realize NO ONE ELSE would think it odd other than me that the family did not leave after the first visit, so this will be the last I have to say on the subject of the family moving.
If you are implying that I have had no crime in my "real world" that would cause me to pick up and move my family at the drop of the hat, you are in fact correct. I haven't. If you are implying that I am out of touch with reality and what people should or shouldn't or could or couldn't do, you are sadly mistaken. I have a missing person's blog of my own and yes I follow true crime (mostly missing person's cases) on a regular basis and have for many years.
With that said, I have read enough to know that the Mexican Drug Cartel is no one to screw around with period. I (and I am saying "I", not you or them or anyone else) would have definitely found a way off that property after the first visit from them if I had to resort with staying with family for awhile until I could make other arrangements. BUT, that's me and that is MY opinion.
Thanks for your input though.
Respectfully,
Posted 10/18/2008 at 05:49:38 PMKindraLore
I would like to clarify some things for some of you. First of all I was a little off on the time frame since they were notified and moved it was actually closer to 5 weeks since the mother was informed of the threat. This seems like a pretty reasonable and realistic amount of time for someone to take to move. During this time Cole was in another location with family but he just came back a few days before because they thought it was safe since they were just about to move. As I stated earlier this happened on the last day they were to live in the house he was taken from. Second I never blamed the police or said they got it wrong I simply said (and I was right as Steve has pointed out so many times) that the media did not have the whole story the police did from the beginning and were only get bits and pieces (and yes some false reports) so it seemed like the mom was changing her story to the general public when in fact the story she told the police has always been consistent. Razzy, where do you get the information that the grandfather is a convicted felon? I have no knowledge of this nor have I heard it being reported at all. I really don't want to attack you but are you really taking everything the media is reporting as gospel? (especially Nancy Grace, who tends to twist information, jump to conclusions and has been known to make false reports and allegations) There has already been proof of false reports since this whole thing has started (look at previous posts etc.), the media was originally reporting this as a "random" act and that is just one example. I really am a bit confused about why people still question the truth of my statements when everything I have said is pretty much confirmed by the police (after i say it). I am not going to claim to know it all or be 100% accurate, because Cole's mother very well may have withheld some details or information some of us for good reason, but I dare to state that I have been more accurate than any other reporter or news station out there. Nancy Grace did state other family members may be involved that does not necessarily mean the mother, father or boyfriend. Remember " involvement" may also simply mean that they had knowledge of his activities but not actual participation, just like "person of interest" doesn't always mean the actual suspect but someone who has information important to the investigation. Also remember that knowledge may have been before or after the fact. Another thing the mother was only aware of his involvement in the illegal after he had disappeared. If she was involved or knew before that do you think she would have been stuck around to be found in the house she had lived in for years? She only planned to move after she knew what her father did. If she was involved (meaning selling drugs too) why is she not under arrest right now? He did say he ran an Rv tour business and this is what he used to cover up what he was really doing, which was running drugs. Again I would ask all of you to think logically here most drug runners don't typically tell their entire family that they involved in this type of illegal activity. Ask yourself this, if you were married to say a truck driver who ran drugs would you know it? The people in these kind of professions typically spend many days if not weeks away from home at a time and the family would rarely know what they were doing while away from home during those days. He kept it away from the home and family (as most drug runners do) until obviously he made the dumbest move of his life and stole money and took off. Also I would like you to ask yourself if you would even suspect this type of activity of your husband, father or whatever. I know a lot of people have contact with their family but would have no clue what goes on in their day to day life. There have been many cases where someone has a family member who is a serial killer or rapist and never even suspected it. Come on if your spouse is acting strange you may suspect cheating or something else but would you suspect them of being a drug runner, rapist or murderer? Not likely. That would probably be the last thing you think of. Also if you knew a family member was involved with this kind of thing what more could you do but try to distance yourself from them, would you risk retaliation and turn them in? Most people would not, that could possibly pose a greater threat to you and your family. Do you think this would make you any safer? The wife may have had knowledge but I can't say whether she did or didn't with 100% certainty. Now I have been saying all along that the mother was informed of the threat about a couple of months ago. This has yet to be reported by the police or the media yet put two and two together people...he was last seen on Aug 22nd, the family filed a missing persons report with police on Sept 11th, does this not fit my timeframe of when I say the threat was made? The police were informed about the threat and the fact he was missing around that time, hence the missing persons report. I also want to speak to why the mother has not gone on national T.V. to make a plea, first do you think this will really help? That is typically only done when they are one unaware of who took the child or two do know who took the child ( like a family member abduction) and think a plea might work. This whole time they know who they have been dealing with and know a public plea is probably not going to make these men return the child. These men want something very specific and it is the money and drugs the grandfather stole so no matter how much the mother pleads it is not going to matter. I can guarantee she pled when they were ripping Cole from her home, it didn't stop them then, why would it make them return him now? Remember even if these men who took him have a tiny bit of compassion in their hearts they are nothing more than soldiers in an army. They are following orders from someone, and not following those orders could also lead to the death of them or their families. Also there is a matter of safety, I do have issue with the fact that people are even reporting her name as the police were not doing so for good reason, so going on national T.V. and showing her face is not a great idea. Even after this all comes to a conclusion, in whichever way it does (hopefully with the safe return of Cole), that does not mean the family will be free from danger in any way. Please keep looking for Cole, there is reason to believe he may be in Southern California.
Posted 10/18/2008 at 05:58:53 PMJoe:
I would like to thank you for coming here and giving us a personal side to this. I do want you do know that I am not judging Julie about the move and after you answered me the first time, I was totally satisfied and understood. It was a question lingering for me that you gave answers to.
I hope Cole is found soon and safe. God bless you all.
Posted 10/18/2008 at 06:13:27 PMSorry there is another point I would like to make about the mothers supposed involvement. Again people I keep asking you all to think logically, if the mother was involved in the illegal drug trade, wouldn't the cartel know this and have killed her when they went to her house the first time or the day they kidnapped Cole? I'm assuming they did not kill her or her fiance because they knew she had no involvement and really only wanted to find the grandfather and the missing money and drugs.
Posted 10/18/2008 at 06:19:57 PMKindralore:
Posted 10/18/2008 at 07:38:17 PMI didn't name names or identify anyone as being clueless in this regard. You did that all on yer ownsome. In any case, Joe the Insider's lesson is: don't be quick to judge what others should/shouldn't do under extraordinary circustances with only a handful of sentences provided by the news/blogs.
Kindra - we have a thread going for Cole on IS - trying now to get a forum for him.
My mind has entertained so many scenarios - I even wondered if grandpa knew time was running out for his grandson and had some paid thugs kidnap him for safe keeping. That might explain the canceling of the Ambert Alert. JMO
Praying hard for Cole!
Posted 10/18/2008 at 08:28:44 PMThere is also a thread at www.Helpfindthemissing.org . I noticed they are reffering back to this site in their discussions.
Posted 10/18/2008 at 08:55:59 PM"Joe's" quotes sound decidedly female.
Posted 10/19/2008 at 12:34:37 AMI thought Joe's use of language sounded female, too. Men tend to be much more terse. There's always exceptions.
Joe's been absent of late, but that may not mean anything.
Posted 10/19/2008 at 12:37:53 AM